Go to portrait lens

[Camerashy]

What is your favourite go to lens/aperture/shutter speed/film for a 5x4 head and shoulders portrait?

 

[thronobulax]

What is your favourite go to lens/aperture/shutter speed/film for a 5x4 head and shoulders portrait?

Cannot speak to speed/aperture as it is very lighting dependent, but when I do this (very rarely) I use one of a 203mm f/7.7 Ektar, 210mm f/6.8 Caltar-II or a 14" f/9 Red Dot Artar. These days, if I were to do this, I'd likely use FP4+ or Tmax 100.

I also have an 8 1/2" f/6.3 Commercial Ektar that is well suited for this, but I'm planning to part with it since I have too many lenses

 

[jhotopf]

I don't take many portraits but when I have I've mainly used an Aero Ektar 178mm F2.5 but really should be using my 180mm F5.6 Rodenstock! Also shot a few portraits on the 8x10 with a 300mm F5.6 Fujinon lens. Was thinking of taking my Speed Graphic to the photography show on Saturday and taking a few on a 135mm lens and an Instax wide back (as the rangefinder is calibrated for that focal length).

 

[Soulstar89]

I have a Nikkor w 210mm f5.6 I use with my Wista VX. I REALLY like fomapan 200 at EI100 with strobes. developer id11 1+2 for 10mins. Shame it's so inconsistent. Fp4+ is beautiful at EI80. Apeture, I've shot f5.6-f16, which is tack sharp. I talk with the sitter through the process, and if they need to move, I just start over.

I would love a 300mm as i like 85mm on 35mm and 180mm on 6x7. Sadly, my Wista can't handle that length.

 

[Ian Grant]

I have a Nikkor w 210mm f5.6 I use with my Wista VX. I REALLY like fomapan 200 at EI100 with strobes. developer id11 1+2 for 10mins. Shame it's so inconsistent. Fp4+ is beautiful at EI80. Apeture, I've shot f5.6-f16, which is tack sharp. I talk with the sitter through the process, and if they need to move, I just start over.

I would love a 300mm as i like 85mm on 35mm and 180mm on 6x7. Sadly, my Wista can't handle that length.

With a 210mm on 5x4 you are using the optimal part of the image circle as they almost cover 10x8, so ideal for portraits even quite wide open. An 8"-8¼" (203-210mm) lens was the traditional focal length for a Victorian 5x4 Portrait Petzval lens, it's a great balance I guess roughly 70mm on a 35mm camera.

Equivalent of a 85mm (full frame/35mm format) is a 240mm for 5x4, that's probably the longest lens I'd use for 5x4 portraits. I shoot 10x8 with 300mm lenses, outside with 5x4 no problem, but you need a long studio for indoor shoots.

However, there's another issue, when you use 240mm lenses and longer for 5x4 portraits or close like head & shoulders shots, it's far easier using a camera with rear focus, or better still both front & rear.

Like you, I do use a Wista and that's from experience.

Ian

 

[Soulstar89]

With a 210mm on 5x4 you are using the optimal part of the image circle as they almost cover 10x8, so ideal for portraits even quite wide open. An 8"-8¼" (203-210mm) lens was the traditional focal length for a Victorian 5x4 Portrait Petzval lens, it's a great balance I guess roughly 70mm on a 35mm camera.

Equivalent of a 85mm (full frame/35mm format) is a 240mm for 5x4, that's probably the longest lens I'd use for 5x4 portraits. I shoot 10x8 with 300mm lenses, outside with 5x4 no problem, but you need a long studio for indoor shoots.

However, there's another issue, when you use 240mm lenses and longer for 5x4 portraits or close like head & shoulders shots, it's far easier using a camera with rear focus, or better still both front & rear.

Like you, I do use a Wista and that's from experience.

Ian

I didn’t realise this. Thanks for the heads up Ian. Would love to try one day. I’m thinking of getting a sinar f2 or p2 or studio work.

 

[Nas]

I have a Nikkor w 210mm f5.6 I use with my Wista VX. I REALLY like fomapan 200 at EI100 with strobes. developer id11 1+2 for 10mins. Shame it's so inconsistent. Fp4+ is beautiful at EI80. Apeture, I've shot f5.6-f16, which is tack sharp. I talk with the sitter through the process, and if they need to move, I just start over.

I would love a 300mm as i like 85mm on 35mm and 180mm on 6x7. Sadly, my Wista can't handle that length.

The Nikkor 210/5.6 covers 10x8 without movements and is very wide. I've found Foma sheet film to be consistent when rated at half box speed and used with water as a stop bath. I think the Sinar system is fantastic. The P2 is nice but the P is much better value for money in my experience. They work the same but the P2 does look nicer all in black . If you ever see yourself going to 10x8 down then road, make sure you get the 10x8 rear standard so you don't end up buying two. They're built to hold the extra weight and you can spot them because the horizontal shift dial is in a different position. The 10x8 bellows frames are different between the P and P2 which is annoying.

 

[Francis R]

Nikkor W 210mm f/5.6 with my 4x5 and Foma 200 rated at EI160. Aperture often f/45 since I mostly shoot studio portraits with flashes.

 

[Soulstar89]

The Nikkor 210/5.6 covers 10x8 without movements and is very wide. I've found Foma sheet film to be consistent when rated at half box speed and used with water as a stop bath. I think the Sinar system is fantastic. The P2 is nice but the P is much better value for money in my experience. They work the same but the P2 does look nicer all in black . If you ever see yourself going to 10x8 down then road, make sure you get the 10x8 rear standard so you don't end up buying two. They're built to hold the extra weight and you can spot them because the horizontal shift dial is in a different position. The 10x8 bellows frames are different between the P and P2 which is annoying.

I romanticise on 8x10 then I see the cost lol. I visited John on here to try and play around with his sinar p. Very nice camera. Strictly studio use imo as it’s not light lol.

On foma, maybe I’ve had bad luck but the inconsistencies show as black dots in the corners or shattered on sheet. I do use a stop bath for Foma after learn about the salt and pepper dots on my 120 roll. Genuinely love the look of Foma 200 at EI100 with strobes. It’s beautiful.

 

[Soulstar89]

Nikkor W 210mm f/5.6 with my 4x5 and Foma 200 rated at EI160. Aperture often f/45 since I mostly shoot studio portraits with flashes.

Wow Francis shooting at f45. I find with all my lenses with flash over f16 the sharpness in skin texture can be rather unflattering and unforgiving. The lens captures all the pores in skin. That is even with massive soft light modifiers.

I’m actually investigating looking into using tights over the lens to soften the image. Or something like a tiffens pro mist filter.

 

[Nas]

I romanticise on 8x10 then I see the cost lol. I visited John on here to try and play around with his sinar p. Very nice camera. Strictly studio use imo as it’s not light lol.

On foma, maybe I’ve had bad luck but the inconsistencies show as black dots in the corners or shattered on sheet. I do use a stop bath for Foma after learn about the salt and pepper dots on my 120 roll. Genuinely love the look of Foma 200 at EI100 with strobes. It’s beautiful.

The Foma instructions state DO NOT use a stop bath, use water instead. Give it a try and see if the black dots disappear. 10x8 Foma prices are the best we can hope for. There's also paper neg, positive paper, x-ray film. It's a special occasion format, not for everyday use .
I agree, the Sinar P is good for studio use or working close to your car.

 

[Nas]

Wow Francis shooting at f45. I find with all my lenses with flash over f16 the sharpness in skin texture can be rather unflattering and unforgiving. The lens captures all the pores in skin. That is even with massive soft light modifiers.

I’m actually investigating looking into using tights over the lens to soften the image. Or something like a tiffens pro mist filter.

Agreed. The resolution of 5x4 with modern lenses stopped down results in getting closer to digital than I like. This is what led me down the rabbit hole of old lenses, petzval, uncoated, scratched etc. The rabbit hole is deep but it's a lot of fun and is nowhere near a digital looking result . It all depends what you're after, film gives you lots of options.

 

[Ian Grant]

I have way too many 210mm lenses, the keepers are my 210mm f5.6Symmar S, a Dallmeyer 2B 8¼" (210mm) f3 Portrait Petzval, and a 210mm f6.8 Geronar. The latter is a modern multi-coated Cooke Triplet, supposed to be excellent for portraits at wider apertures.

Of course, I have RR lenses around 8", as well as 3 Kodak 203mm f7.7 Ektars, and 8" Dagor cells that came in a broken shutter.

I'll be listing some lenses for sale, soon.

Ian

 

[Soulstar89]

The Foma instructions state DO NOT use a stop bath, use water instead. Give it a try and see if the black dots disappear. 10x8 Foma prices are the best we can hope for. It's a special occasion format, not for everyday use .
I agree, the Sinar P is good for studio use or working close to your car.

I miss typed. I should have written I do use water stop bath with foma.

When I lifted to move the camera and tripod I was shocked. It made me look and see the weight, it’s around 6kg.

 

[Soulstar89]

Agreed. The resolution of 5x4 with modern lenses stopped down results in getting closer to digital than I like. This is what led me down the rabbit hole of old lenses, petzval, uncoated, scratched etc. The rabbit hole is deep but it's a lot of fun and is nowhere near a digital looking result . It all depends what you're after, film gives you lots of options.

A friend who I bought the fujinon 135mm from is a camera operator and suggested I look into tights or filters when I spoke on the clinical performance. I would love to explore older lenses but I would get lost in the rabbit hole lol. I play bass guitar and building a pedalboard and finding a pedal that has tube/value like warmth is endless lol.

 

[Soulstar89]

I have way too many 210mm lenses, the keepers are my 210mm f5.6Symmar S, a Dallmeyer 2B 8¼" (210mm) f3 Portrait Petzval, and a 210mm f6.8 Geronar. The latter is a modern multi-coated Cooke Triplet, supposed to be excellent for portraits at wider apertures.

Of course, I have RR lenses around 8", as well as 3 Kodak 303, f7.7 Ektars, and 8" Dagor cells that came in a broken shutter.

I'll be listing some lenses for sale, soon.

Ian

I’ve soo much to learn and explore. It feels overwhelming. You must have gems.

 

[Nas]

A friend who I bought the fujinon 135mm from is a camera operator and suggested I look into tights or filters when I spoke on the clinical performance. I would love to explore older lenses but I would get lost in the rabbit hole lol. I play bass guitar and building a pedalboard and finding a pedal that has tube/value like warmth is endless lol.

The tights in front of a lens is a very old trick for printing portraits in a darkroom. Give it a go but when using it over your camera lens you're baking in the effect, same with a pro mist filter. I'm sure you know that (it's a bit obvious) but the benefit of using it over the enlarger lens (if you're printing wet) is you can experiment with different types. I wonder what kind of results a pro mist filter over an enlarger lens would give you.

 

[Ian Grant]

I’ve soo much to learn and explore. It feels overwhelming. You must have gems.

On other Forums Dan Fromm always suggests if you want to know how good a lens is "Ask it". By that he means use it and see, you won't know without trying for yourself.

You quickly learn the contrast difference between Multi-Coated, Coated, & Uncoated lenses, of similar design, and then how design types itself also affect contrast with in-coated lenses. And then there's lens design, and how they differ in behaviour particularly at wider apertures.

As Nas says, sometimes we don't want the feel of a modern multi-coated lens shot at its optimal aperture, so we use older lenses.

The quality of older lenses can be quite surprising, I was amazed when I first used my Dallmeyer 2B, also my 1940/1 12" f6.8 Dagor.

Ian

 

[Soulstar89]

On other Forums Dan Fromm always suggests if you want to know how good a lens is "Ask it". By that he means use it and see, you won't know without trying for yourself.

You quickly learn the contrast difference between Multi-Coated, Coated, & Uncoated lenses, of similar design, and then how design types itself also affect contrast with in-coated lenses. And then there's lens design, and how they differ in behaviour particularly at wider apertures.

As Nas says, sometimes we don't want the feel of a modern multi-coated lens shot at its optimal aperture, so we use older lenses.

The quality of older lenses can be quite surprising, I was amazed when I first used my Dallmeyer 2B, also my 1940/1 12" f6.8 Dagor.

Ian

That’s fair, Ian. I’ve found moving on large format gear to be much slower than smaller formats and also some items rarely pop up so trying before you buy is tricky. Couple that with my indecisiveness results in a very slow process lol.

I just need to explore more basically. When I visited John he showed me so many different types of large format cameras and also lenses.

 

[Nas]

In other threads I've shared pictures made with my Dallmeyer 2B 8¼" (210mm) f3 Portrait Petzval lens so I won't clog up the forum by reposting but it would be nice to see some shots from Ian and his .