5x7 Film holders

[Flack]

I got a couple of film 5x7 film holders they have printed on them Lisco Regal 13x8cm. I used two sheets of Formapan 200.

I noticed when I loaded the sheets they went in the slots very easy to my other Fidelity, dark slides, and thought at the time that went straight forward loading them.

But when I came to unload the dark slide, my Fidelity holders you have to slide them out in the direction of the hinge. But on the Lisco dark slides I put my finger nail under the notch to lift and slide the sheet out, but it just lifted straight out. I thought I had not loaded the sheets correctly.

So I did a test on a ruined sheet of 5x7 and to my surprise the sheet of Formapan 200 was just to small to fit in both side of the dark slide, if you held the dark slide horizontal you could just see along the top edge of the film with the dark slide cover removed. The bottom hinge flap was still holding the sheet from dropping out.
Is Formapan 5x7 slightly smaller in size?. I have developed the sheets and my first quick check they seem to be ok but not checked the focus on them yet.
Any thoughts on this from the gurus on here.

 

[jhotopf]

I got a couple of film 5x7 film holders they have printed on them Lisco Regal 13x8cm. I used two sheets of Formapan 200.

I noticed when I loaded the sheets they went in the slots very easy to my other Fidelity, dark slides, and thought at the time that went straight forward loading them.

But when I came to unload the dark slide, my Fidelity holders you have to slide them out in the direction of the hinge. But on the Lisco dark slides I put my finger nail under the notch to lift and slide the sheet out, but it just lifted straight out. I thought I had not loaded the sheets correctly.

So I did a test on a ruined sheet of 5x7 and to my surprise the sheet of Formapan 200 was just to small to fit in both side of the dark slide, if you held the dark slide horizontal you could just see along the top edge of the film with the dark slide cover removed. The bottom hinge flap was still holding the sheet from dropping out.
Is Formapan 5x7 slightly smaller in size?. I have developed the sheets and my first quick check they seem to be ok but not checked the focus on them yet.
Any thoughts on this from the gurus on here.

I do have some fomapan 5x7 it is 175.5mm x 125.5mm x 175.5 so slightly less than 13cm x 18cm of your dimensions, which would put those holders at 5.12" x 7.09", I would expect a true 5x7 neg to be a fraction less than the official 5x7 size so there is a bit of margin to slide them in but this explains your discrepancy. The 5x7 sheets I have all all fit my 5x7 holders, often in the UK you come across slightly smaller sizes (half plate I think). Maybe trim the longer side until it only just fits width of the holder to see what the actual dimensions of the holder are. I notice the fomapan is a little thinner than the ilford negs which might also explain it.

 

[Dave_P]

The easy answer is that your Lisco holders are not 5x7" holders. Actual 13x8cm film is larger than 5x7", so if the holders are 13x8cm and the film you're trying to use is 5x7" then what you're describing is exactly what you'd expect to happen.

Worth noting that 13x8cm and 5x7" holders are the same size externally and fit the same cameras. But they are made for different sized film. (What's worse is some have 5x7 moulded into the plastic nameplate but actually fit 13x8cm film internally!)

 

[Ian Grant]

The easy answer is that your Lisco holders are not 5x7" holders. Actual 13x8cm film is larger than 5x7", so if the holders are 13x8cm and the film you're trying to use is 5x7" then what you're describing is exactly what you'd expect to happen.

Worth noting that 13x8cm and 5x7" holders are the same size externally and fit the same cameras. But they are made for different sized film. (What's worse is some have 5x7 moulded into the plastic nameplate but actually fit 13x8cm film internally!)

Fidelity Half Plate holders are similar, with the moulding saying 5x7, then in White marked as Half Plate. It's the same with 9x12 & 5x4, and 18x24 & 10x8 film holders.

I posted a warning a while back as 2 UK eBay sellers were selling Half plate holders as 7x5.

Film sizes are nominal the ISO standard has slight tolerances,so there is a slight variation in sheet films.

Film in sheets
5.1 Preferred sizes
Nominal and aim dimensions, together with their tolerances, for preferred sheet film sizes shall conform to the
values given in table 6.

That's from the ISO but I don't have the table, this was from Ilford.



Over the years I've noticed there is a slight difference with different makes of 5x4 sheet film. Some 7x5 film will be fine in a 13x18 holder, others if narrower may fall out in transport or use.

Ian

 

[Nas]

X-ray film is your friend for the 13x18cm holders. It’s what I use.

 

[Ian Grant]

ISO 1012, which covers Photographic sheet films sizes, is not available for free, it gets updated/renewed every few years.

The tolerances on width are tighter than length, which makes sense, the depth of the notch codes is also included as 2.5mm max.



Ian

 

[HowLarge]

Unfortunately half plate , 5x7 and 13x18 are , well a challenge , do not give up with the 13x18 , cut a thin strip of the spoilt sheet and glue or tape it to the film guides with a double layer/step to stop. the good sheet falling out fiddly but cheaper than new holders.
At least you do not have half plate holders moulded 5x7 and the paint worn off as that's too small and trimming fresh film is not fun, nor was taking 10 holders on a trip and finding they would not load.